This is a total misnomer. I'm talking about the title. What we have here is a compilation of 7 senryuu (川柳) and 8 haiku (俳句). I leave it to your judgement to discern which is which. Traditionally, haiku tend to be elevated in tone, more in tune with nature and the passing seasons, whereas senryuu cast a wry and caustic look on human behaviour. Both use exactly the same 5-7-5 syllabic format.
------------------
1.
My private student
shyly exposes her breasts --
what do I do now?
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2.
Millions of insects,
tiny transient tourists --
Japan in summer.
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3.
Two glasses of beer
and your face goes scarlet red --
school reunion.
--------------------
4. (revised, thanks to og!)
Dripping ice-cream cones.
Each in summer kimono --
Five little schoolgirls.
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5.
At the funeral
my friend is gone forever
soft cold misty rain.
----------------------
This is not a quiz. It's just a bit of reflective fun. I realize looking at a whole row of haiku one after another gets a bit tiring. My Japanese friends tend to be rather strict in literary matters and would doubtless class all of the five above and the ten to follow as dubious senryuu. I'll tell you why below.
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6.
Leaving the office
a whole day of black and white
bursts into colour
-----------------------
7.
at the festival
starlight shines upon your hair
only I can see.
________________
8.
Pale and unsmiling,
avoid like hell by daylight --
nightclub Russian girls.
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9.
Here comes Jonathan!
May a truck roll over him --
please please let me drive.
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10.
A life without love
avoids all complications,
leaves you dead and dry.
----------------------
Time for another break from the poems. They are only truly effective in isolation. A string of them rather dilutes their power and takes away their stand-alone presence, their "is"-ness, for want of a better term. My Japanese friends, to continue, believe that only pure poets can write haiku, which means, in effect, that the poet must be Japanese and will most certainly not write in English!! They do have a point. Modern haiku are sclerotic in the sense that they have been surrounded by an accumulation of so many subtle rules that they have become almost impossible to write by any normal non-expert Japanese, let alone a foreigner. This is pure nonsense, of course, as a glance at the great free-wheeling iconoclasts of the 17th century makes immediately apparent. Unpredictability and originality have since come to be discerned as dangerous and negative values in Japan, however, with the concomitant need to ruthlessly stamp them out wherever and whenever they occur in the interests of "Wa" -- national harmony. Hence, to cut a rather interesting story short, the "taming" of haiku, along with everything and everyone else, including the ongoing failure of the educational system and the inability to deal with the iniquities of the imperial past.
-------------------------------
11.
Exploding fireworks --
love strikes at my heart again:
summer kimonos.
______________________
12.
Fanatic patriots,
all with the same half-dazed look --
Yasukuni Shrine.
______________________
13.
Late for work again!
Hurrying, jostle a blind girl,
I am so sorry.
------------------------------
14.
She tells me her name,
says it means "the holy child" --
no, I don't think so.
------------------------------
15.
Sake, more sake,
in cups of fresh-cut cedar --
ooh, the dancing moon!
-------------------------------
Well, I thought we'd never get to the end but we did. No more haiku from me for a while. See if you can separate them out into senryuu and haiku. Right, so. Good luck.
Just out of interest ... let me know if the Japanese characters below show up on your computer. They should. Doesn't mean they will.
じゃあ、皆さんこれで終わりにしましょうか
気を付けて家に帰て下さい
近いうちにまた話しましょう
Sayonara. さようなら
Jaa, minnasan, kore de owari ni shimashou ka?
Kiotsukete ie ni kaitte kudasai.
Chikai uchi ni mata hanashimashou.
Right, everyone, let's finish up here, OK?
Safe home (well, you're probably there already)
Let's talk again soon.
Good-bye.
Fifteen Haiku
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marten
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From 3 years of highschool Japanese, I did detect 'hanashimasu' as 'to talk' and 'kiotsukete,' isn't that said to get someone's attention, or sit up straight - hai or ie? Well that was 8 years ago and I'm afraid not much of the language has remained in my brain. Whatever you wrote did not show up in hirigana, katakana, or kanji - too bad the characters of Nihongo are much more elegant and artistic than our chickenscratch letters. I liked your haiku about leaving the office, the funeral, and the sake. Time for me to ikimasu.
sayonara,
jiye-ga san
sayonara,
jiye-ga san
Well you know you can't spend what you ain't got,
you can't lose some blues you ain't never had -Muddy Waters
you can't lose some blues you ain't never had -Muddy Waters
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marten
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On some it seemed to almost combine a wry look at humanity, and the natural or something asthetic. As I have never written senryuu or haiku, some are distinguishable, others not so much.
I'll be a good sport and play the game
1. H
2. S
3. H
4. H
5. H
6. H
7. H
8. S
9. S
10. S
11. H
12. S
13. S
14. S
15. H
1, 6, and 15 seemed a bit borderline.
Will I get a grade for this, Teach? You can red pen all the errors, haha...
take it easy,
Marten
I'll be a good sport and play the game
1. H
2. S
3. H
4. H
5. H
6. H
7. H
8. S
9. S
10. S
11. H
12. S
13. S
14. S
15. H
1, 6, and 15 seemed a bit borderline.
Will I get a grade for this, Teach? You can red pen all the errors, haha...
take it easy,
Marten
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juliadebeauvoir
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This one was an absolutely charming image--liked lots.Dripping ice-cream cones.
Each in summer kimono --
Five little girls.
This one made me laugh. You're a terrible man, aren't you?Pale and unsmiling,
avoid like hell by daylight --
nightclub Russian girls.
Cheers,
Kimberly
"Freedom is what you do with what's been done to you."
Hi Kim,
Nice of you to look back at these poems ... they were sort of on the point of disappearing. I like haiku/sennryu (whatever) because they are so fresh and direct and you have to say it quick -- 5/7/5 -- no mucking about!!
You can't really work at them. They either click or they don't. That's another thing I like since it's a bit like Chinese or Japanese calligraphy (not quite, of course) since the brush strokes have to be spot on and instantaneous with no hope of revision of any kind. Well, you can revise haiku, change a few words here and there, but you shouldn't is what I think I'm saying.
It's a change from other kinds of "considered" poetry, for lack of a more accurate description. Brush masters would go into a contemplative mode and sit motionless for half an hour or more before furiously executing the finished characters in about 15 seconds flat. That, to my mind, is the way the best haiku get done.
Anyway, thanks for keeping a benevolent eye on an unruly flock among which I must unfortunately number myself. I get carried away and I'm not always on my best behaviour. I don't see the need for it, to be honest. Open your mind and let it rip; then put some sense on it with the form and structure of a poem. It's a means of handling chaos with a measure of human intelligence, not just throwing up your arms and giving into it. I have no faith or belief or trust in any of the alternative methods I have seen so far.
Best wishes,
dedalus (Brendan)
Nice of you to look back at these poems ... they were sort of on the point of disappearing. I like haiku/sennryu (whatever) because they are so fresh and direct and you have to say it quick -- 5/7/5 -- no mucking about!!
You can't really work at them. They either click or they don't. That's another thing I like since it's a bit like Chinese or Japanese calligraphy (not quite, of course) since the brush strokes have to be spot on and instantaneous with no hope of revision of any kind. Well, you can revise haiku, change a few words here and there, but you shouldn't is what I think I'm saying.
It's a change from other kinds of "considered" poetry, for lack of a more accurate description. Brush masters would go into a contemplative mode and sit motionless for half an hour or more before furiously executing the finished characters in about 15 seconds flat. That, to my mind, is the way the best haiku get done.
Anyway, thanks for keeping a benevolent eye on an unruly flock among which I must unfortunately number myself. I get carried away and I'm not always on my best behaviour. I don't see the need for it, to be honest. Open your mind and let it rip; then put some sense on it with the form and structure of a poem. It's a means of handling chaos with a measure of human intelligence, not just throwing up your arms and giving into it. I have no faith or belief or trust in any of the alternative methods I have seen so far.
Best wishes,
dedalus (Brendan)
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thoke
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- Location: Nottingham
These are the ones I thought were haikus:
1 – I thought this one was great. Very vivid.
2
3
4
5 – This one didn’t quite work for me. The 2nd and 3rd lines seemed only loosely connected. Maybe it's because I asumed that the funeral was indoors, and then the last line suddenly threw me out into the rain... if the funeral was outside maybe you could indicate that earlier on, somehow. Or maybe that would be impossible.
6 – Maybe this is senryuu, I’m not sure. Another really good one. Again the image is simple but beautiful and very vivid; it feels complete.
7
11
13 – I think this is also one of the best. You kind of describe three different things, and risk cramming too much in to such a tiny poem, but somehow it works really well.
15
I don't know all that much about haiku, but it seems to me that if you can evoke a vivid and complete image with just 17 syllables then you've achieved something good, and I think you manage this in a lot of them.
I thought the following ones were senryuu. I wasn’t as keen on some of these. In three of them, it seems like you’re doing two things: describing a situation, and commenting on it. Which seems like a lot to cram into such a small structure, and I’m left wanting more information. In most of the haikus you were just describing a single moment and saying nothing else, and that seemed to work perfectly.
8
9
10 – I did like this one, and it’s the only one of the 15 that I’m absolutely certain is senryuu and not haiku. Nice and bleak, despite the optimistic second line.
12 – This one was also brilliant, but maybe it’s a haiku? This and number 10 work better than the other senryuu, I think, because you aren’t obviously doing two separate things (describing and then commenting). In 10 you just express an idea, and 12 is like a haiku except that your attitudes are strongly implied by the words you use in the haiku-like description of the moment.
14
1 – I thought this one was great. Very vivid.
2
3
4
5 – This one didn’t quite work for me. The 2nd and 3rd lines seemed only loosely connected. Maybe it's because I asumed that the funeral was indoors, and then the last line suddenly threw me out into the rain... if the funeral was outside maybe you could indicate that earlier on, somehow. Or maybe that would be impossible.
6 – Maybe this is senryuu, I’m not sure. Another really good one. Again the image is simple but beautiful and very vivid; it feels complete.
7
11
13 – I think this is also one of the best. You kind of describe three different things, and risk cramming too much in to such a tiny poem, but somehow it works really well.
15
I don't know all that much about haiku, but it seems to me that if you can evoke a vivid and complete image with just 17 syllables then you've achieved something good, and I think you manage this in a lot of them.
I thought the following ones were senryuu. I wasn’t as keen on some of these. In three of them, it seems like you’re doing two things: describing a situation, and commenting on it. Which seems like a lot to cram into such a small structure, and I’m left wanting more information. In most of the haikus you were just describing a single moment and saying nothing else, and that seemed to work perfectly.
8
9
10 – I did like this one, and it’s the only one of the 15 that I’m absolutely certain is senryuu and not haiku. Nice and bleak, despite the optimistic second line.
12 – This one was also brilliant, but maybe it’s a haiku? This and number 10 work better than the other senryuu, I think, because you aren’t obviously doing two separate things (describing and then commenting). In 10 you just express an idea, and 12 is like a haiku except that your attitudes are strongly implied by the words you use in the haiku-like description of the moment.
14
Thank you, thoke, for the comments and for taking some time over figuring out which were sennryu and which were haiku! Since Marten (My Fire) did the same earlier in the month, I think it's only fair to go public with my own "opinions" (for that is what they are now, no longer certainties!). Here's the list:
1. S
2. H
3. S
4. H
5. bit of both
6. H
7. H
8. S
9. S
10. another toss-up
11. H
12. S
13. S
14. S
15. H
Cheers,
Brendan
1. S
2. H
3. S
4. H
5. bit of both
6. H
7. H
8. S
9. S
10. another toss-up
11. H
12. S
13. S
14. S
15. H
Cheers,
Brendan
Some great ones here. I like nos. 4, 6 and 11 especially. Especially 11. Fantastic image.
And 15 of course. Oh yes. Shine on, dancing moon.
The sad thing is that a whole generation (at least) of Brits were introduced to the haiku by James Bond. And his haiku was bollocks. Read it here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Only_Live_Twice
And 15 of course. Oh yes. Shine on, dancing moon.
The sad thing is that a whole generation (at least) of Brits were introduced to the haiku by James Bond. And his haiku was bollocks. Read it here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Only_Live_Twice
You only live twice:
Once when you're born
And once when you look death in the face.
It's not a haiku, to start with ...
Also, it is total crap.
Yes, well, no surprises there.
But that brings us to the interesting matter of
JISSEI NO KU
Haiku composed
at the point of ritual suicide.
As Johnson, in faraway London, remarked,
imminent death
remarkably
concentrates the mind.
Once when you're born
And once when you look death in the face.
It's not a haiku, to start with ...
Also, it is total crap.
Yes, well, no surprises there.
But that brings us to the interesting matter of
JISSEI NO KU
Haiku composed
at the point of ritual suicide.
As Johnson, in faraway London, remarked,
imminent death
remarkably
concentrates the mind.
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oranggunung
- Preponderant Poster
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Dedalus
I am a fan of the format (5,7,5), but probably not capable of writing anything that might be considered haiku by the Japanese. I have taken a trip on the haiku train, none the less.
I liked several of the verses you provided. I guess different images and ideas strike chords in different people. It's interesting to see the various receptions to them.
Just a small point, but one that no-one else seems to have raised. Poem number 4 is neither a haiku nor a senryuu, as it has a 5-7-4 format.
Five little schoolgirls.
would bring the syllable count back into line.
og
I am a fan of the format (5,7,5), but probably not capable of writing anything that might be considered haiku by the Japanese. I have taken a trip on the haiku train, none the less.
I liked several of the verses you provided. I guess different images and ideas strike chords in different people. It's interesting to see the various receptions to them.
Just a small point, but one that no-one else seems to have raised. Poem number 4 is neither a haiku nor a senryuu, as it has a 5-7-4 format.
Five little schoolgirls.
would bring the syllable count back into line.
og
Well spotted, og. 'Five little schoolgirls' it shall be.
I'm not altogether surprised that you were the one to discover the anomaly. I have been quietly impressed with the meticulous attention to metre and rhythm (quite apart from rhyme) that shines forth in the poems you have posted.
The crits may seem a bit overwhelming at first but they are nearly always well thought out and genuinely meant to be helpful. The lads have been on to you, I notice, about getting away from old-fashioned usages and constructions. A bit of exploration and expansion of range might well be helpful to you and I wouldn't worry too much about experimenting online, so to speak. On the other hand, all the poetic decisions ultimately rest with yourself -- which is the way it should be.
I'm fairly new to the forum myself and I've grown to appreciate it more and more as time goes on. Some of the writing is absolutely brilliant and there is always something amusing or interesting or intriguing going on which makes it a very attractive place to hang around in. The crits can be severe at times but they are never mean-spirited. I'm fairly sure it won't take you long to settle in. Welcome aboard!
Brendan (dedalus)
I'm not altogether surprised that you were the one to discover the anomaly. I have been quietly impressed with the meticulous attention to metre and rhythm (quite apart from rhyme) that shines forth in the poems you have posted.
The crits may seem a bit overwhelming at first but they are nearly always well thought out and genuinely meant to be helpful. The lads have been on to you, I notice, about getting away from old-fashioned usages and constructions. A bit of exploration and expansion of range might well be helpful to you and I wouldn't worry too much about experimenting online, so to speak. On the other hand, all the poetic decisions ultimately rest with yourself -- which is the way it should be.
I'm fairly new to the forum myself and I've grown to appreciate it more and more as time goes on. Some of the writing is absolutely brilliant and there is always something amusing or interesting or intriguing going on which makes it a very attractive place to hang around in. The crits can be severe at times but they are never mean-spirited. I'm fairly sure it won't take you long to settle in. Welcome aboard!
Brendan (dedalus)