Mathematics - 2nd edit

[Patrick92]

Mathematics 2nd edit

Parallel lines will never intersect,
So it is with us. This double
Helix within me shall never be unflexed
For you because when I look at you,
Everything fades away into nothingness
And drops out of exsistance.

Gentle oscillation is all I can
Hope for, relentless movement
Between conflicting extremes.
You are my zeta function,
My unsolvable mystery.
Who can keep me obsessed for
As long as I live,

ForI know I can never know of any
Problem greater than this:
One plus one equals one.

My perspective is being
Smothered,by symbols and
Numbers swarming in my head
Like locusts. Malignant
And petulant.They devour
Everything... everything
But you.

Mathematics-edit

Parallel lines will never intersect,
So it is with us.This twisting double helix
Within me shall never be flattened
Out for you,because when I look at
You, all the trigonometric waves
Are lost deep in your eyes.

Harmonic oscillation is all I can
Seem to dream of, in the chord
That runs through my heart.
You are my zeta function,
My unsolvable mystery,
The ultimate triumph of
Passion for art.

But ultimately I can never
Know of any problem greater or
More difficult than this:
One plus one equals one.
I cannot function when I'm
Without you. I'm in a sea of numbers
And symbols and am starting
To sink deeper and deeper
Into this bottomless ocean.

Mathematics

Parallel lines will never intersect,
They remain on their straight course
For all eternity, so it is with us.
This twisting double helix within me
Shall never be flattened out for you,
For you can not see the patterns I do.
Because when I look at you, all the
Trigonometric functions are lost
Deep in your eyes.

Harmonic oscillation is all I can
Seem to dream of, in the chord
That runs through my heart.
I should be thinking of zeta
Function or a problem of complex
calculus. But I never do.
I can just think of this intricate
Matrix that is me and you.

But ultimately I can never
Know of any problem greater or
More difficult than this:
One plus one equals two.
This remains when I'm without
You. I'm in a sea of numbers
And symbols and am starting
To sink deeper and deeper
Into this bottomless ocean.

[Ros]

Great idea, Patrick. I like this. If it were mine, I might stick to the images and miss out the 'bits I'm thinking', the bits about running through me, the bits about my heart. Like this:

Parallel lines never intersect.
So with us. This twisting double helix
shall never be flattened for you.
Trigonometric functions are lost
deep in your eyes.

This is just a rough attempt to show what I mean, obviously - the reader will fill in the details about the relationship. Anyway, just a thought, obviously ignore if it's in completely the wrong direction!

Ros

[arunansu]

This is a fabulous poem, Patrick. You have amazingly used the metaphors. One thing, one plus one always make two. Always!

Enjoyed.

[David]

As Pete Townshend told us,

And like one and one don't make two
One and one make one

[Arian]

I really liked the idea behind this, and it starts strongly. For me, though, it rather loses its way. Perhaps it’s trying too hard to use mathsy metaphors for various aspects of the whole Love thing, with the result that they become a bit tortuous. I’m afraid I struggled to make sense of “trig functions are lost...etc” and the connection with the Zeta function or complex calculus. Why should you be thinking of them? On the other hand, it seemed to me that there’s a lost opportunity (as I say, it’s a very neat idea) to play upon (for example) the fact that the Z function is (still) one of the great mysteries of mathematics, or that 1+1 can represent a total greater than 2 (with a change of base), or...Oh, I don’t know, there’s lots of things. Sorry Patrick, it didn’t work for me – though it so easily might have done.

All the best
peter

[Patrick92]

thanks for ur feedback arian. i agree it is a bit clunky reading back on it so im taking a big pair of scissors and glue to this one. i didnt give too much thought to zeta functions etc. im gonna definately look at that. and im not saying that i should be thinking about these maths problems literally just a vehicle to show distraction.

[Arian]

im not saying that i should be thinking about these maths problems literally just a vehicle to show distraction.

Ahh, I see (sound of penny dropping)! That's a perfectly legit reason to say it - perhaps you could find a (poetic) way to help the reader connect with the reason.

cheers
peter

[Patrick92]

aha no worries... any ideas on how to make that connection for the reader??? im at a bit of loss here thanks

[Arian]

Hi Patrick,
generally, I'm against changing others' poems, as it's such a liberty. But, since you've asked...

Haven't given it a lot of thought - I'm a bit unsure, in parts, of what your original was trying to say, but here's my off-the-cuff take on your piece, which may or may not be better.

All the best
peter




Parallel lines can never intersect, and
so it is with us. The double helix that is me
will never flatten, but remain
tightly twisted: I can only be
with you through the patterns you
do not see,
reflected in the trigonometry
lost behind your eyes.

Harmonic oscillation should be simple, but
not for me. The complex resonance – undeniable
and unstoppable - between our hearts
has taken over, assumed command, and
like the zeta mystery that yet remains
from Reimann,
you will never yield your secret:
leaving me, like one of Cantor’s sets,
unresolved in number, if not
in sense, demanding us to merge
like a Venn diagram gone mad.

Ultimately, no - I can never know
of any satisfaction greater or more complete
than this: that one plus one equals one
in any base, and that our binary forms
must merge within a sea of numbers,
creating unity from plurality
through the mathematics of love.



As I say, it's pretty much off the top of my head, but I hope it's of use in some way or another.

cheers
peter

[Patrick92]

thanks some good ideas i might adapt in a second edit

[Arian]

Pleasure, look forward to seeing it.

[Patrick92]

Parallel lines will never intersect
So it is with us. Thi twisting double
Helix within me shall never be unflexed
For you, because when I look at you,
All the waves of trigonometry
Unweave and flat-line.

Harmonic oscillation is all I can
Hope for, some undying movement
between positives and negatives.
You are my zeta function,
My unsovable mystery constantly
A changing parallax of mystery.

But I can never know of any
Problem greater than this:
One plus one becomes one.
My perspective is smothered
by a hush of numbers swallowing
Me up. Under the cruel moon light
I drown...I drown...I drown

Mathematics-edit

Parallel lines will never intersect,
So it is with us.This twisting double helix
Within me shall never be flattened
Out for you,because when I look at
You, all the trigonometric waves
Are lost deep in your eyes.

Harmonic oscillation is all I can
Seem to dream of, in the chord
That runs through my heart.
You are my zeta function,
My unsolvable mystery,
The ultimate triumph of
Passion for art.

But ultimately I can never
Know of any problem greater or
More difficult than this:
One plus one equals one.
I cannot function when I'm
Without you. I'm in a sea of numbers
And symbols and am starting
To sink deeper and deeper
Into this bottomless ocean.

Mathematics

Parallel lines will never intersect,
They remain on their straight course
For all eternity, so it is with us.
This twisting double helix within me
Shall never be flattened out for you,
For you can not see the patterns I do.
Because when I look at you, all the
Trigonometric functions are lost
Deep in your eyes.

Harmonic oscillation is all I can
Seem to dream of, in the chord
That runs through my heart.
I should be thinking of zeta
Function or a problem of complex
calculus. But I never do.
I can just think of this intricate
Matrix that is me and you.

But ultimately I can never
Know of any problem greater or
More difficult than this:
One plus one equals two.
This remains when I'm without
You. I'm in a sea of numbers
And symbols and am starting
To sink deeper and deeper
Into this bottomless ocean.

[Arian]

Hi patrick

Not a crit - just a point of process. It might be helpful to other readers if you posted your new version as a part of the previous thread, so they can relate it more easily to what's gone before.
Cheers
peter

[Lovely]

I thought me abstract at times in poems but liked this though.

In Zen there is only 'One Number' they say, all the rest are animations of
that rainbow of flowers yet, others most truly say ,there is only One Light;
the true love which can't take me away. This is peace I guess, and the
true Masters in Light and Peace. Those who held 'those realms
high' well before any kind of 'earthly' religions. May you seek to know this.

Much,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJIDr15duZk

speak to you soon I hope,

love x

l x

[David]

Not a crit - just a point of process. It might be helpful to other readers if you posted your new version as a part of the previous thread, so they can relate it more easily to what's gone before.
Cheers
peter

I can do that, I think.

[Patrick92]

could i get some feedback on this second edit??? im still not sure whether this one works entirely
thanks
Patrick

[Arian]

Hi Patrick,
Some changes for the better here, but – for me – it’s still a good idea that’s misfiring, I’m afraid. Putting aside the “micro” stuff (typos, lack of punctuation etc), it still has the same essential “macro” problem – the mathsy metaphors tend to be either meaningless (or, rather, I can’t decipher them – not, I admit, necessarily the same as being meaningless) or they sound strained. But perhaps, as a mathematician, I’m over-sensitive.

By the way, “twisting double helix” is a tautology – helixes twist by their nature. It’s a bit like talking about a four-sided square or a round circle.
Sorry to be a bit negative, hope you’ll do a further revision! You’ll get there!

Cheers
peter

[Patrick92]

thanks for that. I hope I've made some of the metaphors a bit better if not, can you just point them for me because I understand them all. If they are meaningless how so?
thanks for your input
Patrick

[Ros]

I think you're getting towards the heart of this. I suppose the problem with the metaphors is that when you say things like

All the waves of trigonometry
fade away into nothingness.

I'm not sure what they are a metaphor *of*: which part of her, or your relationship, are you actually getting at? It's a nice phrase but I can't pin down the actual metaphor. When you move on to gentle oscillation, that's better, as I can imagine her feelings for you hovering back and forth.

Double helix is good because I can relate that to genetics - yours and hers entwining etc. Zeta function I know nothing about, but if it's something not solved or unfathomable again that's good, as it can show a relationship.

I think your new ending

Under the cruel moon light
I drown...I drown...I drown

is less good - you need to keep it mathematical, I think - something about seeing all the angles, or something?

Ros

[Arian]

Hi Patrick
I think this latest edit is stronger now – I think it benefits greatly from the punctuation you’ve added.

My reservations on the maths stuff aren’t so relevant now, as you’ve (good move!) cut some of them (parallax, complex calculus etc). I still have probs with L3-6 – waves of trigonometry. Sure, trig functions can produce wave shapes, but I find it very hard to relate to the metaphor – I just can’t work out what it's saying. And an ever expanding vector of mystery...sorry, leaves me completely baffled. As does being smothered by a hush of numbers.

To me, the strongest image in the piece is the one pus one equals one thing (very strong). I think you could start of with this and build a nice piece with fragments of the rest of it. It would still be about mathematics.

All the best
peter

[Patrick92]

well about the trigonometry waves one its not so much a metaphor as an expression. what im trying to say is that when i look at her everything sought of fades away and every rigid principle just drops out of exsistance to me that what i was trying to get at really with that line. The hush of numbers is like a great tidal wave of numbers falling on top of me i suppose i get what i mean but you may not haha. and the vector thing im not sure still either i just couldn't think of anything mathsy to put in.

[Arian]

when i look at her everything sought of fades away and every rigid principle just drops out of exsistance

Patrick, that's the irony - in explaining what you mean by these (to me) awkward metpahors, you're being much more poetic (and descriptive) than the metaphor itself. As I said before, it's as if you've chained yourself to the poem's title - because you've decided to call it mathematics, you're crowbarring mathsy stuff in, come what may, even though its meaning is all but inaccessible. The result sounds artificial. Whereas, if you just said what you think, in the style of your explanations, you'd end up with something pretty good. More relaxed and natural. There's nothing wrong with the occasional allusion to maths (the one plus one thing is great), but you don't need to stuff it full of jargon to justify the title.

Cheers
peter

[Patrick92]

you are so right thanks i just got it really for me
i've re-edited it and made it longer and added a new bit on the end. Not maths related really but it kind of describes what I felt at the time.
Thanks
Patrick

[Arian]

Much more natural sounding, patrick, and some very nice lines now. Told you you'd get there!

Cheers
peter

there's a couple of typos in it, by the way.