Poetry Forum

Original

When stars are faint and men forget.
As the moon swallows herself,
slips below glittering acres.
A day breaks.

And as he turns, ebbs and flows,
turns again, as he always does.
I stand at the edge, content
almost free.
At the edge, enchanted.


Revised Punctuation (with thanks to David)

When stars are faint and men forget,
as the moon swallows herself
and slips below glittering acres,
a day breaks.

And as he turns, ebbs and flows,
turns again, as he always does,
I stand at the edge, content,
almost free.
At the edge, enchanted.

Mmmesmie. I like this.

I think you need a comma after "acres", rather than a full stop, but "As the moon swallows herself" is a terrific line.

Actually, I think you need another one after "does". That's the trouble with those sentences starting "As ..." - they presuppose another clause. And, looking at it again, after "forget" as well. Your sentences are more complex than you seem to realise, mes, but I think that's good.

In fact, if I did nothing but repunctuate it, it would look like this:

When stars are faint and men forget,
as the moon swallows herself,
slips below glittering acres,
a day breaks.

And as he turns, ebbs and flows,
turns again, as he always does,
I stand at the edge, content,
almost free.
At the edge, enchanted.

I'm torn by that penultimate line - is it a full stop or a semicolon? I think the full stop works fine.

This is good. It's a moment you've captured in an image. Nice.

Very interesting that you made the moon a he. That's unusual. What's the thinking there?

Cheers

David

David

I am crap at punctuation, I do try though! I read then go back and usually end up messing about with it again I need you in my pocket to sort me out!

I don't think I have ever used a semi-colon instead of a full stop..now that's a confession and a half..

As to making the sea masculine...that was a little playing about with relationships, in my mind.

I am not sure about the two and's I have used, dunno whether to change one of them..maybe the first one to yet or then or something?.

What do you think?

anyways David
thanks for thinking over this one
mes x

mesmie wrote:As to making the sea masculine...that was a little playing about with relationships, in my mind.

I thought it was the moon! Je suis un thicko.

David..

heheheh..it's a bit of a jump from the moon to the sea in two verses..I think many would think it the moon too!

I like to confuse

mes x

The moon has swallowed herself in v1, so is feminine. I like it with the new punc, mesmie. It's a bit odd starting with 'he' for the sea - a rather unattached pronoun - but I rather like it here.

Ros

hello Ros

Many thanks for that comment and I am pleased you think the 'he' works.

I tried for a bit of a tussle between the moon/sea, he/she thing.

mes x

I suck at critique. Forgive me in advance for my sins.

The punctuation is an improvement, yet I felt attacked by a swarm of commas. You could eliminate one right off the bat by doing this:

When stars are faint and men forget,
as the moon swallows herself, (adding "and" and taking this comma away)
slips below glittering acres,
a day breaks.

This will also help the flow. Read it aloud. My way. The new "and" will complement the preceding one and further stress the two remaining commas.

As for V2, I don't really know what to say. This is where the buzzing commas become a real nuisance and the writing weakens though. So I guess I would suggest a bit of a rewrite for those reasons. I mean, there's a hint of the sublime in V1, but V2 just hasn't got it.

To pick on it in the sense that it's clumsy...

AS he turns/AS he always does

The repetition of "as" is not very refined in that context.

Ebbs and flows

A bit (a lot) cliche.

at the edge/At the edge

More repetition that doesn't work the way it's supposed to.

Anyway, my thoughts.

I love this poem mesmie. Nothing but good comments from me, although, I do prefer your original posting, before the punctuation changes.
I'm no expert on punctuation either, I struggle myself, but I think sometimes you have to stay true to your own creativity and 'way of writing'.
I honestly don't believe it always matters if the punctuation isn't perfect, it's the feeling and passion in the words and meaning which is most important to me!
Just my opinion, but I think you've written a beautiful poem here. You have captured a moment really well and the imagery is lovely.( I think you got the he/she thing just right too! )
A great write from you, thanks for sharing.
firefly x

I enjoyed this, i love the sea. punctuation helps the flow and makes it easier for the reader to absorb

firefly wrote: I'm no expert on punctuation either, I struggle myself, but I think sometimes you have to stay true to your own creativity and 'way of writing'.
I honestly don't believe it always matters if the punctuation isn't perfect, it's the feeling and passion in the words and meaning which is most important to me!

firefly x

But firefly, the purpose of being here is to learn how to express that feeling and passion in original and effective ways. Like anything else, there's a craft here, techniques to be learned, just when doing carpentry or painting in watercolours. And those that do take on board all the comments and do read widely can see themselves improve. I know, cos I wince at the stuff I was writing a few years ago.

Ros

I agree with most of the comments above – it’s elegantly expressed and has some fresh images – especially the moon swallowing herself. I do think that the beginning of s2 is confusing at first, as “he” seems to be referring to the moon. An extra line at the start of s2 introducing the sea could make it a grammatically clean transition.
But whatever, I like it a lot. A neat, thoughtful piece.

But...

I honestly don't believe it always matters if the punctuation isn't perfect, it's the feeling and passion in the words and meaning which is most important to me!

If you were writing wholly and exclusively for yourself, that would be fine. But the very fact that you’re sharing your work implies that you also want others to read/enjoy/understand it. That’s why you need punctuation. It hasn’t evolved over the centuries merely to annoy writers, and be a general pain in their backsides, it’s evolved as a means of helping them to communicate their meaning more clearly and accurately. If you want to faithfully communicate what you’re feeling/thinking, make us feel your passion, you need to know how to use punctuation effectively. And yes, I know – there are examples of famous writers who ignore punctuation. But they’re almost always deliberately breaking the rules – rules they understand in the first place - for a reason. That’s completely different from neither knowing nor caring. Your work shows every sign of being very good – but it won’t be as good as it can be unless you get hold of the punctuation thing. Once you know how to use it properly, you can ignore it with calculated effect – and your work will be the better for it.

Sorry about the lecture. An issue close to my heart. Where’s that Blush emoticon...
peter

hello SS

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I have already used the and as you suggested and it does read better.

Yup that second verse is weaker than the first. I shall try to rethink what feeling I was trying to convey, maybe then it will
compliment the first verse.

Hmmm ebbs and flows..weeelllll will try to rethink, hmmmm..

again thank you
mes

hello firefly

Thanks for your comments and I am so pleased ths write brought you some pleasure.

This poetry lark can be so frustrating at times

mes x

hello anniecat

I am very fortunate to live near to the sea, but the one I wrote of was a little warmer

thanks for your reply.

mes x

hello Peter

Thanks for the positives. I am going back to the second verse and give it a going-over!

Again thank you for your time.

mes x

Hi mes

Glad to see you appear to be sticking around for a while. Seems like a bit of a mini exodus has been occurring, I can't actually see that the board has
played any part in it, so can only conclude that it's all in the cycle of renewal and departure that's tidal

I do enjoy a good old game of pin the tail, so here's a couple of thoughts that you might or otherwise like to consider.


As he turns, ebbs and flows
and turns again as he always does,
I stand at the edge of contentment
where I am almost free.
Here at the edge, enchanted.

I like the piece and will keep an eye and see how you get this finished.

Kindest regards

Danté

Dante

Nice one sir! You have def given me some food for thought.

I thank you for that.

mes x

Oh dear, I'm sorry if I've thrown a spanner in the works with my comments on this one!

I do take on board and appreciate the values of punctuation, and I agree wholeheartedly that it can either 'make or break' a poem at times.

I just posted my thoughts on this particular piece, that's all!

In no way, did I intended to suggest that my comments are more important or valid than the other ones posted, or to take away the obvious value of them to the author, I just said what I felt about the piece.

Sorry if I've insulted anyone here - not intended at-all. Perhaps I shall restrain my opinions in future, don't really want another lecture! I've been walking around with my tail between my legs all day, don't like offending people, and I do respect your advice and skills. I am also passsionate about being creative and I love quirky poetry, so that will always be what I look for and comment on first.

Anyway, apologies for any offence caused,
firefly

That's fine, firefly, I don't think anyone is offended, and we certainly didn't intend to offend you. It's just that beginner's boards in particular can drift into a sort of 'that poem was great, well done' attitude, which is friendly, but doesn't actually help anyone develop. So we're keen to see everyone, even those not very used to critting, point out specific bits that aren't working so well or places where cliched images etc have crept in. Critting is quite hard but I think by studying what others have done and thinking of alternatives, it helps your own work get better.

Ros

firefly wrote:Perhaps I shall restrain my opinions in future, don't really want another lecture!

I hope you don't - free exchange of views is what makes the board interesting and useful.

If anyone should apologise, it's me, for the overly didactic and slightly hectoring tone of my little rant. Didn't mean it in that way - just venting my own view on a well-worn issue, that's all. That's the way it came out. Don't worry - I don't do it often. Well, not very often, anyway.

All the best
peter

This is a lot better.. enchanting

Mesmie,

A beautiful poem. My understanding of the poem is of a female working out the memories of a relationship. The memories of him coming and going like the tide. Almost free.... almost over him, and the standing of edge represented a hope of things to come. I liked it very much.

Suzanne