Thanks for the rambling, Steeve. I understand what you said. Sometimes, it is hard to balance. What do you think of the follwoing translations.
The original text
枯藤老树昏鸦,小桥流水人家,古道西风瘦马.夕阳西下,断肠人在天涯.
Tr. 1
Withered vines hanging on old branches,
Returning crows croaking at dusk.
A few houses hidden past a narrow bridge
And below the bridge a quiet creek running.
Down a worn path, in the west wind,
A lean horse comes plodding.
The sun dips down in the west
And the lovesick traveler is still at the end of the world.
Tr. 2
Withered vines, old tree, crows at dusk,
small bridge, running brook, and houses,
acient road, west wind, bony horse.
The sun setting in the west,
a heart-torn traveler at the end of the world.
Probably none works for you.
Lake
Sitting Silently
Actually they both work for me
If pressed I prefer the first one because it has a more western feel although the second one keeps the form more accurately. From my limited knowledge of the script (ie what my Chinese friends have told me) I suspect that there are nuances within the script that a native reader would understand to flesh out the sparce words.
Very nice
Steve
PS I'll return to them when I've had a chance to fully think about them
If pressed I prefer the first one because it has a more western feel although the second one keeps the form more accurately. From my limited knowledge of the script (ie what my Chinese friends have told me) I suspect that there are nuances within the script that a native reader would understand to flesh out the sparce words.
Very nice
Steve
PS I'll return to them when I've had a chance to fully think about them
A question that shows the lack of my knowledge.
Is there a form of Chinese poetry where the five line stanza is a formal requirement (like the rigidity of the Haiku)?
I ask because it seems that a lot of the poems seem to be in this five line format. If so, then maybe a translation should actually reflect that formality.
Steve
Is there a form of Chinese poetry where the five line stanza is a formal requirement (like the rigidity of the Haiku)?
I ask because it seems that a lot of the poems seem to be in this five line format. If so, then maybe a translation should actually reflect that formality.
Steve
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Hi again, Lake
It’s just like that
as if waiting for the guest to talk
I sip tea quietly in silence
The reason I mentioned the possibility of the alternative interpretation is that your original word-ordering as above
is capable of both interpretations.
So - it's probably best to stick with that.
@Steve
Very interesting post - it hits the nail on the head. Not rambling at all.
Geoff
It’s just like that
as if waiting for the guest to talk
I sip tea quietly in silence
The reason I mentioned the possibility of the alternative interpretation is that your original word-ordering as above
is capable of both interpretations.
So - it's probably best to stick with that.
@Steve
Very interesting post - it hits the nail on the head. Not rambling at all.
Geoff
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?
Hi Steve,oggiesnr wrote: Is there a form of Chinese poetry where the five line stanza is a formal requirement (like the rigidity of the Haiku)?
I ask because it seems that a lot of the poems seem to be in this five line format. If so, then maybe a translation should actually reflect that formality.
There are different forms of Chinese poetry. The above one is actually written in a certian tune, with five lines, each has six characters except line four which has four characters, and with a rhyme scheme.
A lot of times, the translation can be done in the same number of lines, but impositble to have the exact number of words, or syllables in a line. If rhyme is applied, I find, in most cases, the translation feels forced, unnatual or in danger of loosing some meaning. It is then interesting to see that a lot of poemes translated by Chinese are rhymed (with the above mentioned drawbacks),while western translations are unrhymed. I am not sure if the westerners know the poem's rhyme scheme or they deliberately don't use it to reserve the essense.
Lake
Aim, then, to be aimless.
Seek neither publication, nor acclaim:
Submit without submitting.
一 Cameron
Seek neither publication, nor acclaim:
Submit without submitting.
一 Cameron
Hi Steve,
These are crucial issues in translating, not ramblings—isn't this why they say translators of poetry need to be poets themselves?
Jackie
These are crucial issues in translating, not ramblings—isn't this why they say translators of poetry need to be poets themselves?
Jackie
oggiesnr wrote:
Could you possibly post the standard forms and rhyme schemes that are commonly used?
I'll try. Here is the form, there are other variations of course:
5 sentences, 28 words, three level tone rhyme, two oblique tone rhyme.
平平仄仄平平,
仄平平仄平平,
仄仄平平仄仄,
仄平平仄,
仄平平仄平平。
平 in blue, denotes level tone
仄 in red, denotes oblique tone
The end words should be rhymed.
Is it helpful or even more confusing?
Lake
Aim, then, to be aimless.
Seek neither publication, nor acclaim:
Submit without submitting.
一 Cameron
Seek neither publication, nor acclaim:
Submit without submitting.
一 Cameron