Stations Of The Cross

[Denis Joe]

I must leave here, I cannot breathe this warmth.
World-grey envelopes the quiet coldness
whilst the ground mirrors the sky and skyline;
sweet wrapper rustling with each hard step.
The mist takes on a smell of water paint:
swirling colours in a jam-jar, like vomit.
I stiffen knowing I will lose something
of a romance formed in cigarette smoke
from a butt, on a shore, smelling of sand,
making it hard to tell where land begins.

[Suzanne]

The mist takes on a smell of water paint:
swirling colours in a jam-jar, like vomit.
.

What a line. Wow. It hit hard. I have to go wash my face and shake it off. Lol.
I'll watch as you get feedback. Nice.
Suzanne

[brianedwards]

Denis, how about you start this from

Ground mirrors sky and skyline,
sweet wrappers rustling with each hard step.

What follows from there is excellent.

B.

[Sharra]

Denis, the first impression of this for me was that there were a lot of powerful images packed in. I almost wonder if it is a little overloaded and that some of them don’t carry their own weight.

With that first line, the opening feels contradictory – there’s the warmth and the quiet coldness at the same time. So I’m thinking the opening line is where you begin, you then move to the quiet coldness? If that’s the case, I understand the contradiction but think the first line is not needed, it’s probably better to land the reader in the middle of where you want to write about. – especially in such a short poem.

I agree with Suzanne that the lines ‘The mist takes on a smell of water paint:
swirling colours in a jam-jar, like vomit’ is a powerful image. Although, again there is a contradiction here between the swirling colours and the grey mentioned earlier.

I also like the image of the ‘romance formed in cigarette smoke’, but I’m a little confused by the following lines.

This could just be me though, so feel free to ignore
Sharra

[ray miller]

Very nice, I liked the same couplet as Suzanne singled out very much. But all of it is good, I think.
Prefer "of romance" to "of a romance" and I think you want envelops rather than envelopes.

[clarabow]

The more I read this the more it grew on me; trying to work the title into the poem but struggling! Might be me...
I am wondering if breaks would help?


I must leave here,
I cannot breath this warmth.
World-grey envelopes
the quiet coldness
whilst the ground mirrors the sky
and skyline; sweet wrapper
rustling with each hard step.

The mist takes on
a smell of water paint:
swirling colours in a jam-jar,
like vomit.

I stiffen knowing
I will lose something
of a romance
formed in cigarette smoke
from a butt, on a shore,
smelling of sand,
making it hard to tell
where land begins.

[John G]

Hello,

For me there are some strong lines and images (the jam jar for instances) however I think it would benefit being structurally different – at the moment it seems to dense and claustrophobic (maybe that was the intention?)

In the third line I would suggest ending it as “

whilst the ground mirrors the sky

”
And “

sweet wrapper rustling with each hard step

.” I woud change it to this "sweet wrapper rustles with each hard step"


But that’s just my opinion.

[Denis Joe]

Denis, how about you start this from

Ground mirrors sky and skyline,
sweet wrappers rustling with each hard step.

B.

I almost wonder if it is a little overloaded and that some of them don’t carry their own weight.

With that first line, the opening feels contradictory – there’s the warmth and the quiet coldness at the same time.

I agree with Suzanne that the lines ‘The mist takes on a smell of water paint:
swirling colours in a jam-jar, like vomit’ is a powerful image. Although, again there is a contradiction here between the swirling colours and the grey mentioned earlier.

Sharra

I think. Prefer "of romance" to "of a romance" and I think you want envelops rather than envelopes.

The ‘a’ just emphasises that it is not a particular romance. The ‘envelopes’ was meant as packing it in a folded paper. But I now wonder whether I’m being over-self-indulgent.

I like the reforming that Clara suggests and I was thinking of something that maintains an obvious structure.

And John, I think ‘sweet wrapper rustling’ may be better read if the words are hyphenated. I never thought of that until now.


Thanks very much for the feedback. Much of this confirms a suspicion that I have about the knowledge of the reader/listener. It also seems to contradict my belief that the reader/listener should not be privy to the thoughts of the poet in order to ‘get the best’.

When I read this poem out in a poetry group there was unanimous agreement that it was s good poem and everyone recognised what was behind it.

The reason being is that it was a test set for us to use 10 lines of Iambic pentameter. Each line should be a stage in our life with the first line being born (it also made me realise that there is a certain weakness in scanning a poem, as regional accents tend to emphasise syllables differently. But that’s another story.) . So this is what I came up with.

I did read it out at a poetry reading and it passed pretty much unnoticed.

All that said does that mean that the poem is constructed correctly?

From the suggestions here, the answer must be ‘No’!

I will take into account what has been said and try to make it better, as a poem.

[Arian]

...make it better, as a poem.

Judged by what criteria, Denis? How are you going to know when it's "better"? When we at PG say so? But why should we be any more reliable as a judge than your poetry group, who liked it? No doubt they're as capable of judging "goodness" as we are. The fact is, neither we, nor they, can provide a definitive, unarguable guide to "poem goodness".

I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to PG members (or your poetry group). Just that you need to avoid writing your poetry by committee. Ultimately, you have to rely on your own instincts.

For my part, I think there's a lot to admire about the piece, especially the powerful first and last lines. (I think you mean "breathe", by the way, in L1 - not breath).

Cheers
peter

[Denis Joe]

Thanks Peter (correction made). looking at my comment it does come across as Uriah Heep.

I never really looked at this poem with a view to reedit. I hold that nothing is beyond improvement and that stands for this poem. I reach a point where I have some poems that I think are 'done'. So any suggestion as to how they can be improved upon is welcome (I didn't say that i agreed with each suggestion but ! look at this in a new light)

The point about the poetry group was that each person knew 'what was behind each of the lines' and why the poem was written. Its not that I want to be obscure, but I don't want the poems to be seen as biographies. So I guess that taking on board comments from here helps to distance me from the poem.

I don't know if that makes sense.

[Sharra]

Hi Denis
That does make sense re your poetry group - if they knew you were trying for a specific structure for example, they probably would have focussed on whether you achieved that. I think sometimes we aim for a specific structure, and its a good exercise to do it, but at the end of the day we often then have to adapt the form to fit the poem,.

Arian is right about the poetry by committee thing, i think all you can do is use comments to question what you've written. One thing also to bear in mind tho, is that possibly people are slightly less honest when critting face to face (unless you really know them) - it's easier to be critical via an online forum.
Sharra

[Arian]

people are slightly less honest when critting face to face (unless you really know them) - it's easier to be critical via an online forum.
Sharra

Good point.

[Denis Joe]

I'm not too sure about that dishonesty thing. It seems to me that it would be the other way around. Why on earth would total strangers decide to be dishonest? Face-to-face however, it is understandable.

But the whole point of criticism is that it should be objective and that the person on the other end is capable of weighing up the validity of criticism.

The points that have been made about this poem have given me something to think about and have also, more importantly, shed light on how I use this form.

Victor Hugo said (though I don't have the exact quote) that whilst he is writing a novel he has total control over it, including meaning. Once it is out there for others to read he has no control over how the book is percieved. If you are writing for yourself then don't allow others to read it. However if you make the move to publish a work then that work takes on a new life and it is at that point that the author must consider other ways of doing things. It doesn't mean that the work has to be changed. People are not always in-tune and so the author then has to take the responsibility to say 'yes' or 'no'.