Modern Metaphysics.

[Petronius]

A lover's universe is Ptolemaic, Warning. Please don't bother with this if you have not read
circling around his central star. the Metaphysical Poets, Donne, Marvell et al. 17th. Century.
Galaxies glitter in her eyes:
the music of the spheres is played for her.
Too soon, alas, he's sure to find
his relatively constant sweet
will at the speed of light retreat.

[LeMinh88]

A lover's universe is Ptolemaic,
circling around his central star.
galaxies glitter in her eyes: "galaxies" follow a period. Why is it not capitalized?
the music of the spheres is played for her.
Too soon, alas, he's sure to find
his relatively constant sweet
will atthe speed of light retreat. typo: atthe

As a theorem for dating goes, I'm not sure I'm sold on this. My problem is the use of the Ptolemaic model, where motions of two or more planets move in a small sphere or circular pattern, as a metaphor. But this piece doesn't feel like a dance of two planets, it feels more like a black hole, where the male dater expects all female to be suck into his gravity. Quite the contrary, he repeals them in a "light retreat." Lastly, is it really a "Modern Metaphysics" when guys have been rejected by women for ages.

[Petronius]

This is my third attempt to comment on your post. The poem is not serious. It is a skit on the poetry of the Metaphysical Poets i.e. Donne, Marvell et al. If you have not read these poets then the poem will mean little to you. As for the Ptolemaic
system of astronomy I use ; it is as follows. The earth is the centre of the universe. Around it are transparent concentric
spheres in which the stars and planets are set. As they revolve they make celestial music i.e. The music of the spheres.
I know of no other version but that is not to say that one does't exist. Thank you for pointing out errors in typing.
Cheers.

[stuartryder]

I had the same problem as Le: what is so modern about this?

"music of the spheres" is a cliche so needs reworking.

Generally I would say that Le is right, if you're going to proffer an image it should be fit for purpose.

Stuart

A lover's universe is Ptolemaic,
circling around his central star.
Galaxies glitter in her eyes:
the music of the spheres is played for her.
Too soon, alas, he's sure to find
his relatively constant sweet
will at the speed of light retreat.

[Wabznasm]

Petronious,

I actually thought this was quite humourous. It's dated, yes, (the inversion, the alas), and some of the execution lacks a little finesse (for instance, the introduction of the woman is a little sudden, and I would suggest you could set that up better by creating an additional section something like 'He shows her...'), but I felt the conceit was warm and quite neat.

And I got a lot of Donne, too, especially in the way you sort of hammer the metaphor into a state of usefulness (I nicked that image from a critic, but it stays). The title works with the poem too -- is it a suggestion that modern metaphysics and science are the thing that'll drag this ptolemic idea of the universe away from the lover's eyes?

Perhaps I'm looking for what I want, but I liked what i found
Dave

[Petronius]

I don't really know what to say. Both of you totally misunderstand the light-hearted litte poem. The only suggestion I cam make is to read the Metaphysical Poets. I can highly recommend them but not just t o understand the poem. It would be
like trying to explain a joke. The point would evaporate. Sorry I did not communicate. I just hope someone will enjoy the joke. Wabznasm. Sorry I can't go on with this; It is a trifle, It is an academic joke by a crusty old academic. I give up too soon. I'll try to explain. The Metaphysical Poets wrote in 17th Century and use what was the latest geographical,scientific
knowledge in their poems e.g. "Shee is my New found Land." and all sorts of odd bits, wichcraft, medicine. They are a little difficult but wonderful to explore. Start with Andrew Marvell's " To his Coy Mistress"John Donne is the greatest of them.
In my poem I start with the kind of imagery they might use and in the second part I try to write as if they had been writing today. The Einstein constant, the speed of light, relativity etc. Hence" Modern Metaphysics."

[dillingworth]

I enjoyed the dissonance here between modern physics and the metaphysical poets - and the whole poem is a conceit in the sense that, like Donne, you create an extended metaphor - the meaning of the poem is at least in part to do with the way you play with the metaphor itself, hence why the shift in the tenor (terms of reference) in the metaphor from ptolemy to einstein et al works well.

one nit to pick, though: in a ptolemaic system there is no "central star"; i'd imagine that's the copernican system? the sun is one of the (i think) eight bodies orbiting the earth, hence in your metaphor the lover would not orbit any kind of star.

happy to be corrected though!

[Petronius]

Yes I know but its not serious. Glad somebody understood and liked it. P

[Basnik]

Hi,

Can I just offer a couple of suggestions? Firstly, the lines are irregular in length (pentameter and tetrameter in no discernible pattern) and this might be fixed for more celestial harmony and metaphysical symmetry. Also, if you used 'round' instead of 'around' in l.2 you'd keep the meter more regular. Why not extend it a little, give it more space (!), extend the conceit and it could be a prime mover.

Rich Basnik

[Petronius]

I surrender. They are pulling the legs and wings of my little butterfly. I see no reason why I should alter "star ". What would you have me write ? "earth" "planet" ? just for the sake of truth. Poets have never been restricted by such a mundane thing as accuracy. The whole flimsy little thing was written in ten minutes to bring a little amusement to an extra-mural class.

[Wabznasm]

Well then you have to be ready for a little bit of looseness in the interpretation. I had a period where I read quite a lot of the metaphysical poets (Donne, Marvell, Herbert - is the latter one?) and found the joke to be more about the ptolemeic system disappearing because of advances in science. So it is not necessarily the c ase that the joke is instantly obvious if the reader has read up on the poets this is referring to.

But as you say this is only a bit of whimsy, so lets just say sod it and move along.

Best
Dave

[stuartryder]

I surrender. They are pulling the legs and wings of my little butterfly. I see no reason why I should alter "star ". What would you have me write ? "earth" "planet" ? just for the sake of truth. Poets have never been restricted by such a mundane thing as accuracy. The whole flimsy little thing was written in ten minutes to bring a little amusement to an extra-mural class.

Petronius

Shortness or lightheartedness of a poem does not excuse the writer from putting in the same effort as a more serious or weighty piece. If anything, they say light verse is harder to write because humour doesn't fall off trees, it it a very serious skill.

Based on your own responses to the feedback you've had, I for one don't think you should have posted this in "Experienced", as you clearly don't want to workshop it, and you seem to want to distance yourself from the responsibility of making it as good as it could be.

Let's keep this section "serious", shall we? (Even if the poem is "light".)

Stuart

[Petronius]

Stuart. You are quite right. It was suggested by a moderator that I should join the experienced group. I perhaps started of on the wrong foot by posting two lighthearted poems. My main complaint about the criticisms is that in most cases the poem was not understood. It requires a good knowledge of metaphysical poetry to see the joke. I first entered the poem in an edit and then erased it. A moderator said it was "marvellous" (I think a good joke on Marvell - a Metaphysical poet) so I posted it to see if anyone else did. Before you condemn my postings in "experienced" read some of my poems in " beginners."
I quite agree I am fit only for the lower slopes Parnasus and I long ago decided that I was not going to be a poet.
Poeta nascitur not fit. and no dedication would alter that. I generally write " clever poems." for a few close friends. Thank you for reading it and I shall try to take to heart you strictures on seriousness.

One last thought. If I didn't understand poem ,which some of the people who posted transparently didn't, I should hesitate to suggest improvements e.g "The music of the spheres "was a cliche when it was deliberately chosen as the language of the
Metaphysical Poets. Tnere are more but I shall leave it there. I only wish that someone would enjoy and see the joke.

[David]

I only wish that someone would enjoy and see the joke.

To be fair, I think that Dave the Wab and dill did. I do. I like it. I think your last line, in phrasing and weighting, is practically perfect Marvell.

Is there room for slightly donnish academic trifles here, though? Hell, yes.

Cheers

David