Poetry Forum

A door opens and no one closes it.
The sky has the lock in its one good hand.
The evening has passed its sell by date.

Newspapers whisper of happiness.
A light will always flicker on and off,
like a lighthouse, dreaming.

Even stone, you’ve forgiven.

Not your best poem, I would say, Tony.

I like the last line.

Cheers,
John

John

Thanks for the reply and all that, but please don't hide behind a response in lieu of a so called critique. There are so, so many bad, trite, boring poems of yours that I have lost count of, that I could have aimed at with a one-liner.

This a poetry forum. We all write shite poetry. Me, you everyone. Don't delude yourself.
One of the "worst" poems I wrote that was ignored in this forum, I sent to Snakeskin, and he absolutely loved it, and wanted more of my work.
Get a reality check.

Tony

I'm away for a day and come back to people sniping at each other and Phil suggesting that we post fewer poems. What's going on?

John, you could have given some reasons why you feel the poem isn't that good. And Tony, you could have responded more graciously.

Regarding the images in the poem, some strike me as more effective than others. Altogether, the images don't seem to have a common thread running through them, but then, dreams are often like that.

Hi Tony,

By all means, think of your poetry whatever you like. I can only tell you what I think of it.

Oh - you seem to have a lot of anger, Tony. You might want to work on that.

Oh, and hi Caleb.

Cheers,
John

ton321 wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 23, 2024 2:44 am

A door opens and no one closes it.
The sky has the lock in its one good hand.
The evening has passed its sell by date.


Newspapers whisper of happiness.
A light will always flicker on and off,
like a lighthouse, dreaming.

Even stone, you’ve forgiven.

Like it a lot Tony. It leaps from the mundane. Like the detachment in L1; the fantastic surreal personification in L2 and the jaded reality of L3. I suspect L4 is ironic, since the news is so loud with unhappiness. The dreaming lighthouse is another great personification and reflects how moments tease with 'illumination'...I know, but I forget what I know, and learn again etc. The closing line was another smile. Been there. Good stuff. I would change the title, too much of a label.

I think that Phil likes the poem because he writes similar stuff. Most people, I think, will find the poem enigmatic. I used to advise people to write clearly, but I don't bother any more.

If I read your poem repeatedly, even to the point of studying it, I can ascribe my own meaning to the various images. In my opinion, though, the images are not so universal that everyone will find meaning in them. But I have to ask myself, is this what we want poetry to be -- something that must be studied and interpreted?

I've said this before, but I'll say it again: It is easier to write enigmatic poetry because it is so hard to judge. Any nonsense can be seen as "deep" if you accept the author's assertion that it means something. When you write to be understood, as I do (and John does), it is much easier for people to judge whether you wrote well or poorly because everyone understands the rules of clear communication.

I have often thought, why shouldn't poetry communicate well, just as good prose does? Not everyone agrees with that. I have a suggestion: In the course of your day, try speaking in obscure metaphors to the people you meet, and see what happens.

Phil, I looked over some of my recent poems, and you have offered comments on only about 30% of them. Perhaps you find my poetry as foreign as yours sometimes seems to me.

John

I don't mind people saying that my poetry is shit, as long as they say why...which you didn't.
This is a poetry forum after all. In all my time on here I have never left a remark like that
and never said why I didn't like the piece.

Thanks mac, for your insights. I've not processed them yet but will get back.

Caleb you have touched on the fact that poetry should make "sense". I suppose I like to write poems that aren't prose. For me my aspiration would to write poetry that had a "vertical" lift off, as Heaney ascribed to Brodsky

but us mere mortals I just write my own kind of poems, that annoy people, like you hopefully

Tony

Hi Tony,

OK, I'll bite. I'll also add that your comment thank fuck, a thread or two ago, added no insight, I think, into my entire MS, and if you go up and read my comment I pointed out what I liked in your poem here. So I say you are mistaken.


A door opens and no one closes it.

*OK. This say to me "THis is poetry." How does the door open? And if it's thanks to a person, which is typical, do you really need "no one" after? I'm not convinced you've thought through the logic of your sentence here.

The sky has the lock in its one good hand.
* Eye-catching metaphor, which reminds me a bit of my hand poems. I don't quite see how it links to the sky, or why the sky should have one good hand and one bad one.

The evening has passed its sell by date.
* this I think is trite.

Newspapers whisper of happiness.
* Do they now? I don't see that in the papers I look at much. Again, I'm being told this is poetry, but I don't see much actual thought behind it.

A light will always flicker on and off,
like a lighthouse, dreaming.

* a light? where is that? Beyond the door? And why doesnt' someone fix it? Is it depersonalized for a reason? Or is someone fiddling with it? or is it OTOH faulty? One wonders.


Even stone, you’ve forgiven.
* Yeah, here I think your method works and you wrote a nice line of poetry. As i commented.

In short, I think this poem is a combination of portentous and trite, as I've explained above. It announces itself as poetry but hasn't done the work to make it so. Or in other words, not your best work, as I originally commented. I still like the last line, it feels like a keeper to me. I put all this more diplomatically the first time around, but since you ask.

Oh - the title doesn't interest me. But maybe that's just me, I can only give you my 2c.

Cheers,
John

A door opens and no one closes it.

*OK. This say to me "THis is poetry." How does the door open? And if it's thanks to a person, which is typical, do you really need "no one" after? I'm not convinced you've thought through the logic of your sentence here.

So there MUST be logic to this?

I'll quote Lou reed from the album Songs for Drella -

Trouble With Classicists

"The trouble with a classicist he looks at a tree
That's all he sees, he paints a tree
The trouble with a classicist he looks at the sky
He doesn't ask why, he just paints a sky"

For the sake of argument he also sings:

"The trouble with an impressionist, he looks at a log
And he doesn't know who he is, standing, staring, at this log
And surrealist memories are too amorphous and proud
While those downtown macho painters are just alcoholic"

As for the poem, each line invites you to think about it, each and everyone, i like that. You can envision a whole, you just need to work out the connections. My kind of poetry.

Cheers
Kris

Yes, everyone's different.

Cheers,
John

Yes, everyone's different.

It's accepting those differences that's the key!

Thanks John for the critique, maybe an apology is in order. If you are going to say something, just say why you said it. Surely it's more constructive for your own clarification as well, of your likes and dislikes that can build into your own poetry.

Does anyone actually learn anything on this forum, or are we just sniping from our respective preconceptions of what constitutes poetry?

Thanks Kris for the thumbs up.

Tony

That’s very gracious, Tony. I accept your apology.

Cheers,
John

Does anyone actually learn anything on this forum, or are we just sniping from our respective preconceptions of what constitutes poetry?

A very good point.

Harking back to the 'good old days' of this forum. I learnt so much initially on here. All the simple but arguably vital constituents of writing a poem: Show not tell, don't allow rhyme to lead a poem, half rhymes, slant rhymes and repetition, enjambment, alliteration, allusion...I could go on...It was such a vibrant place to learn.

Alas those days are over and we have to make the best of it. Quite obviously the remaining contributors here do tend to clash sometimes, which unfortunately negates the very essence of the place, what can you do?

Cheers
Kris

Weird, huh?

John