What's in a rose?

[offelias]

Hey guys,
I've not re-written anything I've posted so far but here is my experiment/exercise with rhyming.
Having trouble with keeping the amount of syllables per respective lines in each verse the same so feel free to make suggestions.


I don't suppose you could buy me a rose?
Nor compose for me a love song of forbidden prose.
No. How you oppose feelings of hidden exposed
so God only knows why it was you I chose.

From the throws of life there arose some glows
emanating from those cold snow woes. But you
misdiagnosed, superimposed right under my nose
with your pre-supposed thoughts of how it all goes.

To disclose - you and I are juxtaposed
and I don't wish to reimpose those cupids bows
towards your ghastly clothes which show
your lowered immunity to life's simple roles.

I will never transpose myself for you.

[Danté]

offelias, I apologise for my brevity. It might be useful to forget about the syllables, decide the exact rhythm for each line as in metrical feet, a term which you can also put to one side for now. Once you have the rhythm, run it over in your head and then make your words jog along to that rhythm without any compromise whilst making the syntax and other devices come across as though they've not been hammered into place. It's the accents which need to keep to your rhythm because misplacement can be unnerving to a reader.
You might then find that an occasional syllable anomaly occurs by count, but the feet per line will be accurate and you'll possibly be thinking, yep I've got a lot out of writing this poem.

Take or leave as you wish

I'll get back in a day or two, have fun.


Danté

[offelias]

*gets dictionary out*

Forgetting the terminology for now..
Assuming rhythm to be the general momentum.

I think I understand what your saying - I'll head off and do some exercises to understand properly.
This poetry stuff is a lot to grasp!

[Pauline]

Hi Offelias,
I hope you don't mind, but by tweeking a few of your words,
I feel your poem may read a little smoother.
I read it like this.
PS
I am a total beginner so chances are I have it totally wrong,
but hey, for what it's worth


I don't suppose you could buy me a rose
or compose me a love song of forbidden prose?
You oppose hidden feelings I now expose.
God only knows why it was you I chose.

From the throws of life arose some glows
emanating from those cold snow woes.
You misdiagnosed right under my nose
with pre-supposed thoughts of how it all goes.

To disclose - you and I are juxtaposed
I don't wish to re-impose those cupids bows
towards your ghastly clothes which shows
your lowered immunity to life's simple roles.

I will never transpose myself for you.

I'm not saying it's right, just my take on it.

[arunansu]

Dear OF,

I'd have made it in some other way. I've noticed quite a few words that rhymes with 'rose', throughout. I feel that MAY distract the reader. Here's my take:

I don't suppose you could buy me a rose?
Nor compose for me a love song. No.
How you oppose feelings of hidden exposed?
God only knows why it was you I chose.

From the throws of life there arose some glows
emanating from cold snow woes. But you
misdiagnosed, superimposed with your pre-supposed
thoughts of how it all goes.

You and I are juxtaposed
and I don't wish to reimpose those cupids bows
towards your ghastly clothes which show
your lowered immunity to life's simple roles.


?

Hope this helps.

[offelias]

Hehe. I find it quite amusing that everyone has different ways of reading things. I'm glad though because it's what makes things interesting.
I still haven't re-written this yet but I will do. Been real busy the last 2 days

Thank you guys for your opinions and I'll keep them in mind for the re-write - please don't be offended if I don't use some suggestions though as no doubt my own personal preference will override someone else's.

Struggling with the technical aspects of poetry - in all honesty even basic understanding. I'll get there though. Looking forward to improving.. so much to learn. I have to admit I don't want a technical approach to outweigh the heartfelt approach. How does one go about this compromise? I feel that if I focus too much on technicals then it will no longer be emotional but logical..

Perhaps once I grasp the basics and they become natural then the technical and emotional will work together without force..
Let's wait and see..

(yup - this post is mostly me talking to myself)

[offelias]

I've attempted a re-write.. I'm still unsure about the flow. I've condensed it and taken out a few possibly unnecessary words -
I still don't think it flows well though. Some elements I feel are a little better while I think other aspects have possibly got worse..
I like it being more concise in that it seems a little more snappier emotionally but I think I might have lost a connection between the verses.
Needs more work anyway.. it'll get there

I don't suppose you could buy me a rose?
Nor compose a love song of forbidden prose.
No. How you oppose your feelings exposed -
God knows why it was you I chose.

From the throws of life arose some glows
emanating from those woes.
misdiagnosed - right under my nose
with pre-supposed thoughts of how it all goes.

You and I are juxtaposed.
I don't wish to reimpose cupids bows
towards your clothes which show
your lowered immunity to life's simple roles.

I will never transpose myself for you

[Raincoat]

Hi Offelias, it's nice to see rhyme and this poem feels like you thought about it then selected the words to suit your message rather than the other way around which can often feel forced. I think I prefer the original, it flows better, but I think a few of the words could come out like "no" "superimposed"

[Lovely]

A rose is a rose.Love and lonely?

Whats's in a rose? Love awaiting to manifest?

To touch darlings petals filled with energies atomic
split like a soul with no where to go...more power
to the blackhole. Shines as bright as many suns
collect them all you are the one of many suns

Something to be said about this and the One.

E= mc 2-squared............or energy from mass to light
us perhaps the clown acters here and there a mayflower
in the bush...............remain silent tush.....................

[Lovely]

Where wept the rose as lonely as soul divedied
more no loneliness than this no longer that
perfect kiss! To Soul


sorry just me

[offelias]

No need to apologise It's a nice response!
I like the science terminology.

Raincoat - I agree about preferring the original. Maybe I'm trying too hard to alter it when all it might need is a tweak.
I'll try for the tweak next time and see what happens.. could be that it works.
Could also be that it's just not fixable without some serious gutting since I have got so many rhymes in there.

We shall see...
Thanks guys for the replies too..

[Raincoat]

I agree about tweaking the original - I'd check each and every word and make sure that they are conveying the message you want them to regardless of their place in the rhyme, and if it doesn't work, cut them.

[clarabow]

The first thing is to consider that the Rose (like love) has been written about so many times the subjects have become very worn and cliched ridden. If you are going to write on these subjects it really needs to be original with striking imagery. Rhyming poetry has been written for centuries and unfortunately good and bad poetry has exhausted rhyme to death (nearly) again for rhyme to work (with meter) it really needs to be very very good to take it above the mundane.

2 of the greatest poets Milton, WS, tended to write in blank verse. Your poem as an exercise in writing, to meter, and using rhyme, is a worthwhile one. The musicality of poetry is still very relevant as is rhythmic flow of a line. In this poem the rhyme scheme is very much over-done not only by not having variation i.e. abab or abba, but using internal rhyme as well so that rose prose oppose exposed knows chose arose glows,etc. the reader is left feeling the only thing that matters to the writer is that as much as possible should rhyme? This is overdone and cannot in itself add to the worth of a poem. so as an exercise very good, but for a poem and poetry - not so good.

Writing good meter is not easy and requires much work by the writer if it is going to carry the lines into the next and read well when read aloud. Maybe consider that writing meter does not need rhyme at all! It does need poetic devices (and internal rhyme is one of those) but there are others that you might want to explore as well.

So my suggestion would be to get the meter into a good sound flow (variations in meter are acceptable) before imposing rhyme and then keep the rhyme to a minium and use variation so that it doesn't take over and swamp the thoughts/poem.

[Arian]

I don't want a technical approach to outweigh the heartfelt approach. How does one go about this compromise? I feel that if I focus too much on technicals....

Oh god, not again! How often do we hear this? If I had a pound...

The answer is that it depends on what you mean by the "technicals". It seems to me that, in effect, you're saying "Well, I'd like to write a novel, but I don't want to be hampered by distractions such as spelling, grammar, plot, characterisation, voice, etc."

Basically, you lack confidence in your poetry (nothing wrong with that, most of us do) and you're looking to make excuses in advance by claiming that you've deliberately ignored the "technical" side, whatever that may be, because you're "writing emotionally". In other words you're joining the Anything Goes school, which - if you think about it - may sound wonderfully democratic, but - really - is an attitude that undermines your own efforts. Because, if anything goes, everyone's a poet: every piece of work is of equal status. Which means , even when you produce something you're proud of, you shouldn't be - a trained monkey could have done just as well, by definition.

And yet - sorry, on a high horse, point dear to my heart - you have no reason, as far as I can see from this piece, to make excuses. There's a lot in this to suggest you're perfectly able to produce excellent work. I particularly liked s2 which is rhythmically strong, and wonderfully assonant. In fact, so is the whole thing, really. I enjoyed reading it.

So pleeease! Stop with the "technicals don't matter" crap - they do. What's more, I sense you realise it, or you wouldn't have written a piece that obeyed so many of the "rules" so well.

Cheers
peter

[David]

Perhaps once I grasp the basics and they become natural then the technical and emotional will work together without force..

Yep. You got it.

Cheers

David

[Arian]

Perhaps once I grasp the basics and they become natural then the technical and emotional will work together without force..

Yep. You got it.

Cheers

David

Ah, yes, but the what basics? Tecnical basics? Basics of writng emotionally? Yes, David's endorsement of your view sounds comforting (and I'd agree with it to a limited extent - I know that David and I agree on many fundamental points), but I'd encourage you to take such platitudes with a pinch of salt.

All the best
peter

[offelias]

Hey Arian..

I understand what your saying.

I'd like to mention though that I don't feel like I'm making excuses (although I appreciate it does seem that way).
This poem was an effort to put into context some theory I've tried to learn since joining the board. I'm only ignoring some aspects so that I don't try to understand too much in one go and therefore end up not learning anything at all.

Thanks for the complement regarding enjoying the poem though, and also for the kick up the backside Sometimes it's needed..
No more disclaimers then.

[Arian]

I'm only ignoring some aspects so that I don't try to understand too much in one go and therefore end up not learning anything at all.

Ah, now that's an entirely different thing, and completely reasonable. I possibly misunderstood your original comment, so sorry about the rant.

Cheers
peter

[offelias]

Hehe. No worries Peter.. I'm all for rants helps keep things natural.
Whether you misunderstood or not you had some valid points regardless and I appreciate it - I think it's good to hear people tell it how they feel it. It can be much more constructive.