Mad Anne

[rantingpete]

Mad Anne

When I lived
In my old flat
I had to
Put my ear
To the front door
Before I put
My bins out
In case
Mad Anne
Was
On
The landing.
She smelt of
Cheap white wine
And rolled-up
Tobacco
And if she collared you
You were
Fucked

[Nino]

Hello

Centering your poem does not add anything to it apart from making it hard to read.
Why should I care about Anne or N's old flat? Lots of people drink cheap wine and smoke rollies, but it does not make them mad. Writing in second person will not help me to immerse in this poem, I did not know Ann nor I care about her and the way you executed the poem I can not picture her. Getting fucked: I guess you were going for an impact, but it does not work. Fucked can mean lots of things, including actual intercourse. Instead of telling why N was fucked and why Ann was mad, SHOW it.
This poem is bland, described in vague terms and does not do anything for me.
Thank you for sharin.

Nino

[Rick Joseph]

I liked it, a good and witty insight to life in a flat, I can picture Mad Ann lurking and the writer hiding behind the door. As for the last line: I know exactly what you mean - very succinctly put.

[nar]

Hey, rp.

This raised a smile

For me, the centring, capitalisation and short lines don't quite work.

I think you could use longer lines with sharper line-breaks to make it scan better.

I can relate to this. Had a neighbour in a flat like her once.

Cheers,

- Neil.

[rantingpete]

Nino - it's only 48 words long, not very difficult to read in my opinion. I don't think a left alignment would make an ounce of difference really. Why should you care about Mad Anne? I'm not asking you to care about her. Why should any of us care about any subject in any poem? My poem is biographical and true. My character was mad, simple as that. I'm not saying everyone who smokes and drinks are mad, that would be absurd.
'Fucked' meant 'I couldn't get away from her for hours'. Sorry, you didn't connect with it but I felt 'the less is more' approach gave it more impact. Most of us know a 'Mad Anne' so we should be able to engage with it.

Rick and Neil - Thanks guys - you got it!

[Nino]

I don't think you understand workshop, if you are here just to hear how good you are be my guest, but it will not help you go forward.
Why should we care about any poetry? Reason you write poetry is to evoke images and emotions in reader, why write then?
Thank you Nino

And as I said give this poem to you neighbors, since they know how mad is Anne they will appreciate it, but I can not see how mad is she through your poem.
Keeping short is not a bad idea, but you have to pack them with images to be able to communicate with the reader.
Ego is your worst enemy on the road to become a good writer. I am not here to insult you, just the fact I took time to read and give you lengthy comment means I am not playing around.

[nar]

Hi, Nino.

I don't want to get into a crit-on-crit discussion here, but I see you're new to PG, so it might be worth noting a couple of things.

Beginners here is a place for more gentle crit, with emphasis on the positive or constructive ideas to help 'improve' the piece. I've read a few of your crits, and they are much more focussed on the negative than we are accustomed to here on beginners.

I'm afraid some of what you have to say feels 'lifted' from another poetry forum ("this is not poetry, but a journal entry" etc).

It's not for me to disagree with your crit, but simply to point out that the tone here may be different to that on other forums you've encountered.

Neither is beginners a 'love-in'. Constructive ideas are (for me) the most welcome ones.

I hope this makes sense. If not, please check the posting guidelines and look at how other members provide crit (esp the difference between the beginners & experienced forums).

Thanks and welcome!

- Neil.

[Nino]

Oh I see and apologise for harshness.
Thank you.

How does one move to experienced? At least to offer critique, I don't have any illusions that my poetry is worth posting there for now.

I do apologise, but I do not still see comments like: I like it, I can relate to this as a critique. There must be some way to help us go forward?

Nino

[nar]

@ Nino: The board moderators may be able to clarify, but AFAIK, everyone is welcome to offer crit on Exp (or post your own work) providing it meets the standards expected. If it's not up par, someone will probably give you a gentle nudge in the right direction.

@ pete: sorry your thread got hijacked by me there, but I detected misunderstanding that I couldn't leave alone.


Kindest,

- Neil.

[Nino]

Ok thank you, I might dip my feet later.
And sorry for hijacking your thread Pete: )

[ray miller]

Pete.I think sometimes that less can just be less. Compared to your last poem this is just less interesting, I think, though I like the ending.

Nino, you're welcome to critique my poems on Experienced and be as harsh as you like.

[Ros]

Yes, everyone is welcome to crit in Experienced - and although everyone welcomes a 'great! I loved it!' or 'it doesn't work for me', generally we'd like more substantial critical detail about why it works or doesn't work, with reference to some of the more technical details of metaphor, alliteration, line breaks etc.

Nino, you are right in what you say about abstractions etc - here, it would be nice to have more of a charactization of Anne rather than just saying 'she was mad' - show us what she looked like in detail, maybe speculate as to why she got that way, what she said to you and how it made you feel.

Ros

[rantingpete]

Everything's cool!! hehe

Nino - I must admit, I did find your comments quite aggressive. And you got personal too - I don't have an ego, I'm too long in the teeth for all that nonsense. The use of capital letters i.e SHOW it, suggested you were shouting at me. Or telling me, rather than suggesting opinions. I'm a big boy, I can take criticism.
My poem was just a short humorous piece and should be read as such. I kept it short so as to let the reader imagine the rest. If I'd have changed the ending to:

And if she collared you
You wouldn't be able to get away

That, in my opinion, is anti-climatic and carries no punch.

I appreciate your comments and the time you have taken.

[windowfrost]

I thought it was cool.
I used to have some mad old neighbours back when I was living a grotty old flat, starving and freezing.
I wish I had written more when I was there.
Good work.
RM

[Nino]

I apologise I was not shouting at all: ).I capitalized it to focus your attention on it.
I think it was clear from your first post you were unhappy with my critique, since you.only thanked people who liked it.
I don't want to go on, I have received much, much harsher critique and I know how hard it is to really accept it without getting upset. I was devastated, but then sat down to think and understood this person was doing it for my.own good. Do you want to be a writer? If you constantly hear how good you are how will you improve? If you don't know what flaws are there in your piece how will you go forward?
I apologise again for making you think.I shouted or attacked you personally.
Nino

[Nino]

I apologise for erratic punctuation. I am responding from my mobile and period is next to space, so sometimes I accidentally press it, but can't alter.

[rantingpete]

Thanks Nino.

Apologies - my 'not thanking you' wasn't a conscious one.

I'm not at all upset by any criticism, and I invite you to look at the 3 other poems I posted this week where I have agreed with the crits on all of them including flow, rhythm, metre and the changing/omitting of certain words/stanzas. On this piece, I just didn't agree with the comments that were made. That's all. Because I don't agree with you it doesn't mean I can't accept criticism, it just means I don't agree with the criticism you have made. Forgive me but it feels as though if I don't agree with you then I am wrong which does sound a little self-righteous in my opinion. I'm not saying my poem is anything special or that it's perfect, but to me, it reads exactly how I wanted it to. The irony here, is my poem was intended to be funny!

I just think we prefer different styles of poetry, that's all.

Peace

[Nino]

Hey
No, you can disagree. What right do I have to tell you what to do with your point of view?
Anyway what kind of mad was Anne? What she used to do to freak you out? Why don't you include this in some way to show her character better? I am intrigued.

[rantingpete]

Hi Nino,

Mad Anne, eh! Well, she was actually a lovely lady but she liked a drink. She was in her 50's (I think). She could talk for England and you couldn't get away from her. I used to set my video recorder to tape Eastenders in case I bumped into her when I briefly left my flat. She'd knock on your door at all hours asking for a cigarette. She once asked the guy on the ground floor to look at a leak under her sink. When he went into her flat she was lying on the settee naked shouting, 'F*** me, F*** me'. hehe

Best wishes

Pete

[Nino]

Now this really made me laugh: )
Thank you for sharing.

[Ros]

Hi Nino,

Mad Anne, eh! Well, she was actually a lovely lady but she liked a drink. She was in her 50's (I think). She could talk for England and you couldn't get away from her. I used to set my video recorder to tape Eastenders in case I bumped into her when I briefly left my flat. She'd knock on your door at all hours asking for a cigarette. She once asked the guy on the ground floor to look at a leak under her sink. When he went into her flat she was lying on the settee naked shouting, 'F*** me, F*** me'. hehe

Best wishes

Pete

Pete, this is what I meant! Just put that lot in your poem and you have a much better character description. You left out all the best bits!

Ros

[rantingpete]

Hi Ros,

I know what you mean but I thought if I tell the reader too much about Anne then they would guess the ending and know what was coming. You know when you hear a joke or you watch a comedy sketch and sometimes you just know what's coming, and it spoils the punchline. Also, out of respect for her I thought it best to keep it brief. Unfortunately, I've told everyone all about her now, in my reply comments. D'oh!

Thanks for taking the time out to comment. Much appreciated.

Pete

[Nino]

I am sure Anne would be happy to have caused such riot on poetry workshop: )

[lo-lee-ta]

I think this poem is funny and something that many people can relate to. I don't see what all the fuss about placement is about. I think it's find in the middle.

[rantingpete]

Nino - She'll probably never see it but don't forget, she's mad; I might wake up in the middle of the night and find a horses head in my bed!!

lo-lee-ta - thank you, I agree! hehe

Thanks again for taking time to comment